"Sekaiju no Meikyuu" (Dungeons of the World Tree) will be Atlus' new 3D RPG for the NDS. With only one purpose in mind, players will have to make their way through various traps, solve riddles and fight through ferocious monsters to reach the deepest part of the dungeons. While most RPGs will give you aid by either providing players with a ready-made map or an auto-mapping feature, players will have to draw their own maps in this game via the NDS touchscreen.

Click "Read more" to view my translation of the Famitsu interview with director, Kazuya Niino who is famous for "Trauma Centre". The interview itself can be found in the July issue of Famitsu that's currently on sale.

I kind of agree with him how some games are losing their fun now. A lot of games seem to concentrate more on graphics than on the actual fun and gameplay quality. There are a few exceptions, of course. After reading this, it's really got me looking forward to the game!

Apparently, this game was announced at this year's E3 exhibition as, "Yggdrasil Labyrinth" for the US, sometime in 2007 maybe.

What role did you play in starting the development of this game, Mr. Niino?

I started the rough planning of this game. I wrote the rough draft of the plans, the specification document and also made the decisions... It feels like I'm a director and one of the workers (Laughs) I made most of the decisions really. I'm kind of a designer type person so, during the preview stages, I give quite a lot of opinions so this game will feature a lot of my ideas (Laughs)

What are the concepts behind this title?

The concept's fairly steep. First of all, I wanted to create something that was easy to work out. Since we're working on a title for the NDS, there's quite an abundance of features that we could make use of so, we've been working hard at the contents such as the movies, events and dialogue to make the player understand that, "the goal is to reach the deepest part of the dungeon." However, we're also working on various obstacles and gimmicks to make it difficult for the player to do so. In other words, I want to make a game where players must think about how to clear such problems as they make their way in. With the way the game is paced at currently, players may come across lines such as "The country's being burned" which may lead to him/her thinking, "Do I have to go there? Hmmm, I don't really know." As a result of that, the player may stop playing the game for a while and once he/she resumes the game, he/she won't remember what he/she was doing. In this case, heading to the country because it was being burned. That is why, I want to make a game where the player can sink into, an easy to work out game. With the NDS platform, I think such easy to work out games are viable. That's why we decided to go through our plans again.

I see.

Also, after speaking with the Shin Megami Tensei team, I had an idea of the dungeons they wanted to make and the sort of gimmicks that they couldn't make etc. They told me that, "We want to make normal dungeons!" or "We want to let players enjoy normal dungeons." With that in mind, we decided to start from square one again in an attempt to make a pure 3D dungeon RPG. The plans we have now is something we came up with after looking back at "Wizardry" series of RPGs, trying to think how they may have turned out if we remade them.

It sounds like a game that players of classic games will enjoy.

Yes, I think they will. I hope I can pass on the message that even now, there are such easy to play games like the one we're working on now.

Seems like an awful lot of work is being put into the dungeons.

I can reveal a little about them. They are really designed to be set in the past. However, we're designing them so that players will know things instantly the moment they see it such as this is a gimmick room or, there's a small passageway here without giving the dungeons a modern day feeling to them. Even though this title's theme is set in a forest, there are things such as square rooms. It might sound a little weird if you try to visualize it but, I think it works well in games.

The battles looks kind of complicated, does it not?

Yes (Laughs). First of all, lets make it clear that games where you can just do a lot of button bashing to complete isn't very Atlus-like and not very interesting to us. From our experience with "Trauma Centre", we learned from players that we have to make it simple to play or it'll be too hard to work out. That's what we have to look at. Once, we got an e-mail from a housewife playing Trauma Centre saying that, "there were many parts that I couldn't figure out but, after working hard at it, I managed to clear the game." That's when we thought to ourselves that maybe if we can put some effort into making the game easier to play, we can also increase the difficulty of the game in other areas. With games, I really think it's more important that players can complete the game using their own effort than, making a game designed for them to clear easily. So this time, we thought we could try to create some sort of balance. But all of the Megami Tensei games are already like that, though (Laughs). That's the sort of gameplay style we want to have in this new title. It also makes us think that Atlus wouldn't be around if our games didn't have such an element to them. If our Megami Tensei games were only button bashing games then, we wouldn't have the fanbase we have now.

How will this game involve skill?

There are quite a lot of MMORPGs that are concentrate on skill systems. For example, having a healer who will increase his/her healing power or skills that will boost defence. Being able to customly select which skills you want to learn out of many makes it really enjoyable. That's why we thought we would head in that direction this time. For example, in the case where an enemy has fierce fire attacks, any characters who have chosen to raise their fire defence will be able to defeat the enemy easily while others who have not will have a harder time. It might make the player want to raise their fire defence which gives players more than one way of beating the game. I wanted to increase the difficulty of the battles by letting players customize their skills without compromising the balance. There are many skills that appear in this game that don't appear in the Megami Tensei games so I had to think up special names and ones that match their characteristics from scratch. There's more than 20 skills for all the class available.

Yes, there are many special skill names such as "Ecstasy", isn't there? (Laughs)

(Laughs), "Ecstasy" is a special skill that the Dark Hunter has, a class who makes use of a whip and who can seal certain things. For example, if you command her to keep attacking the head, the enemies' head will be "sealed" and enemies who makes use of parts such as their voice or eyes for their skills won't be able to do so. Sealing their arms means they can't yield a weapon and sealing their legs means they can't use skills that are speed related. When all 3 parts are sealed, they will gain the condition of "imomushi" (caterpillar) and when that happens, the Dark Hunter gains a boost in her attacks. That's what the "Ecstasy" skill is about (Laughs)

I see. So "Ecstasy" is a skill that increases direct damage once all parts of the enemy is sealed.
Yes. There are quite a few powerful skills that increases the damage players inflict like that so we've set some enemies HP levels with that in mind. In normal battles, players deal 50, 100 damage or so while with bosses, I thought we could try exchanging blows of 1000 damage r so.

That's quite exhilirating. Sounds fun.

The maximum HP you can have is 999 but you can exchange up to 1000 damage per hit (Laughs). The system might end up failing. It's the sort of random thing in games that we wanted to keep. Our debugger suggested to us that it would be weird if you could deal 1000 damage when the maximum HP was set to 1000 so we decided to fix it to 999. We want to see how well it works out with this sort of damage system so we're leaving it in at the moment.

That's really extreme. But you would have just laughed at something like that with games from the past.

Yes. But for me, I don't want to say that retro games were the best. I think the history of gaming is still very shallow and while we're improving the user base of games by working with players, many things about games from the past are close to being forgotten. In such times, I think there are many players that are stop playing games because they don't find themselves being really engrossed in the dream world. That is where we want to make a change. Particularly with the Nintendo DS' hardware.

The illustrations feel a little different from the Megami Tensei series.

Yes. We wanted to try something different, so there are parts of the game where we take a different approach. This time, we've decided on using cute characters inside a "green forest". We thought it would be challenge for Atlus if we went for something that wasn't dark and grim, something that we've never done before. With this game, we as Atlus want to make it a benchmark title for us doing all we can to make it a high quality product.

Does that mean you will be working with Mr Yuuji Himukai?

I spoke with a lot of people that enjoy games and they all suggested that I work with Mr. Himukai (Laughs) For example, in the video gaming industry, you don't see many people who would dare to use big dark silhouettes in their designs. Feeling positive about the beauty of such designs, I decided to work with him. Mr Himukai also loves dungeon games so that was another big reason why I chose him (Laughs) Maybe it's fate (Laughs)

Are there any other talented people joining the development?

It's something we wanted to keep within our company and we didn't want to have anyone new. For the story and world settings, I asked Shigeo Komori to join me along with others I wanted to work with but, I wasn't sure about who else at the time. I asked people I knew and also forced Mr. Kojiro (famous for the music in games such as Ys and Sorcerian) join. It might be odd to choose only people that only I myself want to work with but, I think that's the best choice.

So Mr. Koshiro is joining. He's very talented.

Yes, I was over the moon when he said he would join (Laughs). I wanted him to work on something that sounded like game music. Not something that you would heard in movies but something that gives a nostalgic feeling, something that we used to hear as a child. It would be music that people would play the game just to hear. For a moment of time, there was a great interest in game music but all of a sudden it all disappeared and we were wondering why. Game music has probably come a long way and now that they have become more extravagant, it's all blended in with normal music. Something which makes us wonder if we even need game music specifically. That is why we have Mr. Kojiro sampling music from FM sound sources (long ago when soundcards synthesized sounds in the 1970s).

Wow (Laughs)

Of course, it would be boring if we only had music like that alone so, we will also be mixing in some other good music sources, keeping it all with a base of 88 notes so we can emphasize that it's game music.

And if you keep repeating that kind of music...

It'll stick to your mind (Laughs). That's one of the concepts I have with this game. With the music staying with you, the game will remain a memory.

Remain in memory?

I really think it would be great if 5 or 10 years from now, people will be able to talk about this game, laughing with friends. A game that really shines. Games is a culture so I would be really happy if 10 years from now, people would say, "Oh, was there really such a great game?" No matter how well a game sells or how big it becomes, it's sad to think that it becomes forgotten.

Yes, you're right.

Lets take a look at "Trauma Centre". Even now many people are discussing ways of beating the game on the internet. Developers are really happy to see such things happening. Besides getting a game to sell, we also want the game to be talked about and that's how we are making this game. With that in mind, one of the things we have come up with is having a turn counter during battles. It's nothing great but enough to make players ask, "What's that?" There's actually a meaning to this. As the battles are greatly influenced by the way players customize their skills, some players may come up with an idea of defeating a boss in 50 turns while, others may figure out a way of defeating it in 3 turns by rearranging their skills. You could always say, "I beat it easily in 10 minutes" but, that's a bit vague (Laughs) That's why we thought a turn counter would be more exact. Then players can say something like, "If you really beat him that fast, show us a picture." (Laughs) We thought it would be good if we could clarify things like that. We're really working to make it a game that players will talk about a lot with topics such as, "This is how I beat it."

What features are you adding because of the NDS' hardware?

Basically a dungeon that you can map out.

There was some fuss over the how well the feature would work out, wasn't there?

Yes. We didn't add the mapping system in just because there was a touchscreen. Back in office, I was hearing people talk about how people drew their own map in Dungeon Master (a USA RPG from FTL Games) and how maps were like a treasure. Players will remember how they had to draw their own maps and as I really wanted to make a game that people remember, it was something that I had to have in the game. With the NDS' stylus, it's become a reality for me. Drawing maps out with a controller is simply too much trouble. But there was quite a debate about adding their feature in. There was a time when we actually decided to use an auto-map feature and scrap this idea. But then, there were people who said that it would be really easy to draw a map using the touchscreen and that once you start, you just can't stop and that's how we ended up sticking with the idea. I'm really sorry for the programmers but, it was something we were unsure about at the time.

Long ago, players used to draw maps out on graph paper, didn't they?

It's fun drawing out your own maps and it really increases the realism that you yourself cleared sections of the game. The realism in many games today isn't that great. With levels being auto-mapped, all players will be interested in is asking others about what the enemy weaknesses are. When that happens, they will start to think, "Why am I even playing this game?" or "Lets just get a guidebook." I don't want to create a game like that.

Yes, drawing out your own maps will increase the realism. Also, when people pick up the game again say a year or two later, they'll look at the maps and say, "I drew this map!", won't they?

Yes. When they do pickup the game again, they may realize that the map they drew looks a little wrong (Laughs) Something like, "Hmmm, I think I might have drawn the map wrong." Even so, I think players will still be happy. There are many little events on the maps in this game. For example, when you come to a flower bed, insects may appear and if you touch them, you'll get stung. With all these little fun events, I think it will give players incentives to explore the map.

I heard there are wandering monsters called "f.o.e."?
There are the usual random encounters but, you can also see monsters on the top screen wandering about. You'll be able to see many of them by walking around the map. There is an ecosystem among the monsters and every turn you take in battle, they will move a step.

Do they take a step closer in your direction?! (Laughs)

Yes, they do (Laughs) You could find yourself fighting one monster after the other if you happen to be surrounded while in battle. The more turns you take in battle, the more enemies you find you'll be surrounded with.

That's really exciting.

Yes. If the worse comes to worst, you may find a very powerful monster right behind you (Laughs) You'll be making every step carefully to shake off these monsters but, there will also be random battles to stop you. So if there's a strong enemy chasing you then, the battles could end in one turn (Laughs) Being able to display such enemies on one screen while having a map on the other is something that only the Nintendo DS can do.

Can't players avoid these "f.o.e." if all they do is patrol in a circle?

They won't be patrolling in circles as they will have their own AI such as moving according to what they see, what they hear or if the player is directly in front of them. There are all sort of triggers for these "f.o.e." We've added all sorts of little gimmicks such as one where a wolf will attack you if you have some meat. There will be good players who will keep holding the meat and continue through the dungeon but there will also be those that will decide to throw away the meet to avoid the wolf. Players will be clearing this game in stages and once they do, they will remember how to clear the same stage next time they come across it.

Do you gather party members in a guild?

You make them yourself and then add them to your party in a guild.

Do you make all the characters yourself?

Yes. You will be customizing them with one out of 9 classes (see below) available. You then go register them as an adventurer at the guild and manage your party. Of course, you'll be choosing who goes into your main party from the characters you create.

How many can you register?

You can register up to 20 characters. This will allow flexibility as players could raise characters that are all fire based or other elements, adapting to whatever the situation is.

It sounds like it will be hard to defeat certain enemies without the right character.

Yes. Some players don't like the idea of it and say, "Why can't we just have a main party and have to switch members in and out?" The reason is that it's really troublesome to level up multiple characters but as this game will have "f.o.e." monsters, it will be very easy to gain experience points and level new characters. They could replace a weak member of the 5 member party with a new character for example.

I see.

It's kind of complicated how we decided to make the party consist of 5 members. Originally it was 6. With 6 members, it seems you can make a party that's too strong while if we make it 5, it makes players feel like they're always missing one (Laughs) It's good to have a healer in the party but, many times people will also want another mage and when that happens, they can just work on the skills to create the right balance.with their other characters. With this multiple character management, we thought players could reorganise their main party to patch up any weakness. Players will then be able to move in lower level characters into battles to allow them to level up quickly while protecting them. This way, players shouldn't find it troublesome to level a large number of characters. But we've also kept in mind how it would be too much if we didn't allow players to reach the end of the game with one main party.

The names of the classes are very unique.

I wanted to try new names too. I've never had a name like "Curse Maker" before.

Then there's the name "Bushidou" too. Isn't that a Samurai? (Laughs)

Everyone said they don't want to call that class "Samurai" (Laughs) The name is already in Wizardry so we decided to put a little twist into it. Another name we were troubled over with was having "Paladin" instead of "Knight". Knight was something that is common with Japanese RPGs so we decided to choose Paladin, something that sounded more foreign.

It's not that I really a name that's unheard of but, there's a unique feeling about it.

Yes. We didn't want to use a name that players wouldn't understand when they hear it so, we spent some time thinking one up where people would know it.

Since it's a NDS title, will players be able to link?

Unfortunately, no. Games where you could link with other players are interesting in themselves but, with this 3D dungeon RPG, I want to emphasize the solo play so we're leaving it out. However, even though it's not really linking, we will be trying to give players passwords that will allow them to transfer characters to the next game. We thought it would be interesting to allow players to transfer characters that symbolizes they completed the first game, over to a second game.

I understand that players will be able to continue playing in this "second game" but, it's amazing that you're already planning on another game.

It's difficult to say (Laughs). We may allow players to transfer their characters over to a fantasy action game.

Finally, a message to the readers?

This will be an RPG that will be easy to play, easy to work out and enjoy so for those who love dungeon RPGs, make sure you lookout for this game. It's not a game that fools around with you, putting you in tight spots where you can't figure out what to do but, it's a game where you can enjoy yourself and play leisurely. Please do treasure this new title of mine.

Related Links: Famitsu, Official Site.